JoLondon Smith-Givens, Flight Attendant, Friend, Future Pilot

Jo 0:00

What do you mean? What do I want you to do? Pull this plane over.

Robb 0:10

Welcome to another episode of Chewing the Fat. I'm your host, Big Robb. Thank you so much for tuning in, downloading the podcast. I certainly do appreciate that. And to all the folks that have bought me a coffee at ChewingTheFatBR.com. Thank you so much for your financial support. It's a podcast where we help to tell those beautiful, messy human stories. Right now in studio, all the way down from Philly. Please welcome Jo London Smith Givens. Hey Jo.

Jo 0:36

Hey, Robb.

Robb 0:37

You okay?

Jo 0:38

I am.

Robb 0:39

How are you? Your face when I was doing your intro is like, he's talking about me.

Jo 0:44

No, it's so I don't know.

Robb 0:48

So Jo and I became friends because uh she hooked up with one of my best friends, Denise. Uh basically, that's how it is. And uh and so I have grown to love you uh through Denise and seeing how you care for her and making sure that I I know at one point I was like, don't you ever hurt her? And some when we first when we first met. Uh but uh Jo, you're down um from Philly. You and Denise are up that way. Uh but you're down here. You're from the Augusta area, right?

Jo 1:22

Yep, I'm from Augusta.

Robb 1:23

Okay. Okay. So um you are a I don't want to call it the wrong thing. Flight attendant? Yes. Okay. Because it's like, you know, I don't want to say the wrong thing. Um you're a flight attendant up there. You're based, you're based work-wise out of New York, but you live in the Philly area. Yeah. Um was aviation something that was always like a uh a passion of yours when you were growing up here in Augusta?

Jo 1:49

No, actually, I got into aviation because um, you know, one of the big work factories here in T-Mobile. Okay, so I was um working in retention in T-Mobile, and this lady called the cancel, oh my God, I think five lines, which would have hurt me pretty bad. And and um I was just talking to her and everything, convinced her not to cancel. And she, after she calmed down, she was like, Hey, you know, I'm a recruiter for Southwest Airlines, and we're not hiring right now, but have you ever thought about being a flight attendant? You have a great voice. I think, you know, you would you would soothe people while they're trying to travel. Have you ever thought about that? And I was like, oh no, you know, I'm trying to get her off the phone.

Robb 2:31

Right, the clocks ticking in each other.

Jo 2:33

Um, and then that night I went and applied to like 12 different airlines and I yeah. So I was out of there within like three months. I was um at my first airline as a flight attendant. And then um my last one, um, it was a you know, a real small one, uh, which is one flight attendant and two pilots. And so I really got into like asking pilots questions, and that really furthered my my passion for it. Um, so yeah, that's where we are.

Robb 3:02

That's awesome. That's awesome. So let's let's go back then. Well, so what was what was Joe like growing up? What was uh what were you what were you into when you were a kid here in the Augusta area?

Jo 3:11

Okay, so when I was a kid, I was um I was a social butterfly, I guess, but also picked on a lot. I was bullied. Um, I read a lot of books. I was always reading to the point where my mom, she always joked and said she didn't really know how to punish me because it's like, go to your room. Where I'm like, all right, cool, I'll go to my room. I'll go read. All right, cool. She's like, I don't want to take books away from you. So she had to get creative with my punishments and stuff. But yeah, I was reading a lot, played a lot of video games. I was outside. Yeah, just that was I was, yeah, pretty boring, I guess.

Robb 3:55

Well, no, no. I mean, that's that's you know, I think that's uh you you sound like you did the formative work, the way that formative work really, really needs to be done. Uh sometimes we see that missing in kids coming up nowadays, like you said, you know, the just the reading part alone. You know, it's it's sad to see so many. Yeah. They can't read babies, can't read cursive, don't know how to read a clock, you know, all that stuff. Oh my gosh. Um but so what was what was your what was your dream then as that child reading uh You're in Augusta? What did you want to become? What did you want to do?

Jo 4:32

Um I I'll say this. I really didn't know what I wanted to do. Um because I think because like, you know, growing up everybody's like, oh, I want to be a doctor, I want to do this, you know, I want to. Um and then I went I went to Davidson. Okay. And I think Davidson is is obviously a great school, but um the problem is, especially if you don't go in like knowing, I this is what I want to go to college for, right?

Robb 5:04

Like this is the track. Like I want to do theater, I want to do music, I want to do right.

Jo 5:08

Yeah. Davidson makes you just a well-rounded person. It just makes you good at like a lot of different things. And so I really was just kind of like, oh, maybe I could go play oboe because I, you know, played that and then I'll go play oboe somewhere. Maybe I could be a teacher. Um, I just didn't know what I wanted to do. Um, and that was catastrophic when I went to college. It's somebody who doesn't know really what they want to do to a four-year school away from home.

Robb 5:37

Yeah.

Jo 5:37

It's it's a lot of freedom all at once. And yeah.

Robb 5:41

Yeah. So where did you end up going to college then?

Jo 5:44

Um, I started out at the University of West Georgia in Carrollton.

Robb 5:47

Okay.

Jo 5:47

Um, lots of memories, a lot of fun. I actually was a uh I settled on being a chemistry major. Oh, wow. Right. So I I started out being a um a chemistry major with a focus in engineering, chemical engineering.

Robb 6:01

Wow.

Jo 6:02

And I loved it um until I had to take physics. Right? Like chemical engineering, obviously, you would need physics, and I just was not great at it. So I did a complete 180 and switched to English, which I think a lot of people are more familiar with with me. Um, a lot of my friends are they know that I was an English major, but a lot of people don't know that I was chemistry.

Robb 6:27

That's awesome.

Jo 6:27

So I did that um, you know, for a long time. That was what I wanted to do, and I wanted to either be a college professor or be uh a librarian because a lot of people don't know you need to have a master's in library science with a backing in English to be a librarian. So that was something I was looking into. And then um depression. Depression happened. So uh that stopped and I left school for a while until now I'm back in school at almost 40, but yeah, we're doing it.

Robb 7:00

That's hey, hey, that's that's great for you to like say that's something I still want to complete. You know, there are a lot of people that that don't go back and they don't finish.

Jo 7:09

Yeah.

Robb 7:10

Um, but I mean there's something, there's something about the being able to finish something you've started.

Jo 7:16

Yeah. When I saw my my mom, who just turned 60 and she just graduated with her bachelor's degree, and I was like, if it was just such an inspiration um to see her go back to school um, you know, at a later time in life and be successful, graduate with honors.

Robb 7:32

Yeah.

Jo 7:33

And I was like, I I want to finish what I started, maybe not in that degree field. Obviously, I'm not English anymore. I'm right back into aviation.

Robb 7:42

So another 180, but um Which is odd because there's a good bit of physics in aviation.

Jo 7:48

I know, and guess what I got in physics when I retook it? And A.

Robb 7:51

Look at that. You worried about nothing. That's why.

Jo 7:55

I think I was so terrified. I was I had that. Um, I was just traumatized with the per the poor performance I had the first time I tried it, that I really locked in.

Robb 8:07

And yeah. Yeah. That's wild. That's wild. I think I think that's awesome though. But yeah, you know, and like you're saying, sometimes people look and like, oh, well, I've I've already lived a life, I've already become successful in this. Why do I need to go back? I did it without that. And it's not necessarily about the the paper that says you have a degree. It's I think it's about the completion.

Jo 8:27

The completion. I want to finish.

Robb 8:29

Yeah. Yeah.

Jo 8:30

I mean, because that's so close I can taste it, and I just want it done.

Robb 8:33

Exactly. Exactly. No, I l I love that. I love that. Um with the decision to go to to um West Georgia and Carrollton, is that because it was just on the other side of the state away from where you grew up?

Jo 8:47

Or was that Yeah, I I wanted to go for you know what? Honestly, my best friend went there. Okay. Okay. My best friend who graduated a year before me, she graduated from Johnston. And she was there and she loved it. And I visited her my senior year, and I was like, oh yeah, I want to come here. But I got into, you know, like a few other schools, um, Georgia State. Um, I got into SCAD. That see how like crazy I got in a SCAD for photography. Oh, yeah. That's what I'm saying about Davidson. It's just so you just kind of like touch a little bit of everything, and it's hard to decide if you don't have a set track that you want. But um, I got into you know several other schools, um, Mercer, Georgia State, um, SCAD, um, you know, just a few other schools, and and then I just sat on West Georgia because my best friend was there. My parents felt comfortable that she was there.

Robb 9:44

Yeah.

Jo 9:44

Um, that I you knew people and they came and visited, and we found a church there that I went to, you know, and so it just worked out.

Robb 9:52

Right. You you the only daughter, right?

Jo 9:55

The only daughter.

Robb 9:55

Right.

Jo 9:56

The eldest daughter.

Robb 9:57

Right. So so that's I mean, you know, that's important, you know, for you know, mom and dad. Sounds like you grew up in a very good home uh to be feel comfortable you going away.

Jo 10:09

Yeah.

Robb 10:09

You know, and having that like, okay, all right, I know her best friend is there, so I know at least there's another touch point of quote unquote family to keep an eye on. So that's good. Um, so so you've, you know, decided to leave and you came back home? You came back to Augusta. I did college?

Jo 10:29

Yeah, I did. I I came back to Augusta, um, took a little bit of a break, tried my hand at Augusta State, you know, for a little bit, and just I just wasn't ready to go back. So I was at home um until I think 2015. Um yeah, 2015, because that's when I became a flight attendant. So I was at home, yeah. For a little bit, just get in my bearings.

Robb 10:53

Yeah, yeah. And you know, sometimes it takes that. Sometimes it takes the you know college is not for everybody.

Jo 11:00

Right. And not for every time.

Robb 11:04

Yeah.

Jo 11:04

And I think we really push kids to jump straight into, I mean, it's a huge decision and it's an expensive decision. And if you don't know exactly even if you do know exactly what you want to do, something you'll go in. I mean, I was happy as a, you know, doing chemistry classes and doing math classes. I I love math. I was taking, you know, math classes just because I went through a bad breakup and I want, you know, I was, you know, so I I was doing that. And then I took one um particular English class um that was necessary for our core requirements. And I love that professor. And she I already loved reading, and you you have that track, and then you find a class that you like, and you're like, actually I'm gonna do that instead.

Robb 11:53

Yeah, it kind of changes your trajectory. Yeah. Yeah. And I do think that that is one thing that, you know, when gosh, I feel like we ask kids when they're still in primary school, you know, hey, what do you want to be when you grow up? What do you want to be? And everything is it's it's it's about, you know, you pe g people, adults, you're you're dumb well into your 30s. You know what I mean? Because you just don't know. You don't know yourself. You haven't had enough life experience to know what really kind of sets your soul on fire and to and to kind of put that pressure on children, teenagers, young adults to be like, figure it out. It's like you know, that's why, you know, when you when you hear about like, oh well, I backpack through Europe, it's like, uh, well, okay. I don't know, you know, what you necessarily can gain from backpacking through Europe other than just life experience, it's that alone time with yourself to figure out where where those things that you, you know, face those demons you may have, face the, you know, the unknown. Um, but to give kids a a chance to kind of do that.

Jo 13:03

Yeah, to do something because because then you're relying on just yourself and you're away from what you're used to, and you're having to use interpersonal skills that uh you were hopefully taught. I don't know what the kids are taught, but hopefully you've been taught, you know, some nice interpersonal skills and some survival skills, and you put that to use and that's you know, you have to rely on that as opposed to home or school. And yeah, I really hate that we just push kids like like you said, as soon as I mean they're babies and asking, what do you want to do? What it's like there's a difference between wanting someone to be a productive member of society and just turning them to like a workhorse that's fed into the machine of capitalism. And I think that's what uh especially now, what it's really just we're churning these kids out to be, and it's just like which which type of cog do you want to be in this machine? Do you want to be a big one or a little one? Do you want to be oiled or right, right?

Robb 14:05

Yeah, no, that's uh that's that's very valid. Um yeah, and I think it's just being able to approach everyone, children, wherever you're at, with more empathy, more um more wonder about life. Just you you know if you live in wonder, in in exploration and curiosity, um then other people could see that it's okay. Yes, yes, we need the cogs. The machine has to run. There are things that you know that that have to happen, sure. But do we have to lose our sense of whimsy? A sense of whimsy to do that sometimes. Yeah. Which is always when it's great to have, you know, we call them hobbies for those things you do on the weekend because your week is taken up with this job where then you're like you're working for the weekend and you get two days to have fun and to have whimsy, whereas like it should be more a better balance of that. You should be able to be yourself, have some whimsy while you're at work being productive. I think the two can coexist um how that would happen. That's each individual's path, and you have to find that right place to make that happen. And it sounds like you found uh a place where that's kind of allowing that to happen a little bit more for you. You found some happiness, some whimsy, some fulfillment in uh work as a uh uh flight attendant. Um, but also you are working on becoming a pilot as well. Yeah, right? Yeah. Um so talk to me about the the flight attendant side of it first, and we'll talk a little bit about the the journey to pilot. Um because there's gotta be the stories, because we see them on social media. Um is there uh let's do the positive side. Is there a a story that really stands out to you in your experience there that was very positive to you that you felt either proud to be a part of or something like that?

Jo 16:10

Yes. I well, I have um I feel like a lot of those stories. I think I think I have more positive stories than like the funny ones, right?

Robb 16:18

The quote unquote Karen stories.

Jo 16:20

Yeah. Um one of the first ones, um, it was at my first airline. Um, I had it was this customer she came on, and you know, she she seemed a little off, right? And um, and so she was very quiet. She wasn't speaking to anybody, she didn't speak back, which unfortunately is common. But um, but something about her was just a little off. And so I just found myself just gravitating towards her um and just kind of trying to check in on her to see if she needed anything. And um, and then we wound up being delayed, and she got really frantic about that. So I just asked her what was going on, and she said, you know, I'm taking this flight because my mother is on her deathbed. Um, I'm trying to get there to, you know, to say goodbye. And I just I'm I'm you know at my wit's end and I'm about to break down. I'm trying not to. And so I just was trying to be more attentive to her, to her needs, and um just be there for her. And um, at the end of the flight, I made sure that she was up first. And while they were waiting to open the door, I she just hugged me. She just like, she was like, Thank you so much. Um, I don't know what what I would have done, you know, without a person because I'm traveling by myself. I don't have anybody else. And so that was like the first time. Um, and that was all the way back in 2015. I just felt like, oh, this is more than slinging cokes and pretzels. Right. Um, this is, you know, those putting those interpersonal, you know, skills to work, um, and just showing empathy to people and recognizing where people might, their behavior, and even though she wasn't bad, a lot of times we get people where they're acting out because they don't know how to process whatever emotions or you know, what's going on. And so um that was my first time just kind of noting like, okay, this is this is what I can do to help people. You never know why people are traveling, and um, you're supposed to be connecting people from one, not just point A to point B, but just from experience to experience. And um, yeah, so that was my first, my very first time. It's just something that really stayed with me and something I sometimes think about when I'm like, oh when you get the other side of the coin, when you're like all the time. I just kind of do my little all right. Thank you for your feedback. Go ahead and have a seat. The seatbelt sign is on.

Robb 18:50

Yeah. Yeah, so um, well, what do is there another coin story that stands out uh to you?

Jo 19:00

I'm sure you've seen my seen my social media. I don't I don't put them up anymore, but um I will say one of the worst ones I had, I can talk about it now because it's been a few years, but when the pandemic first happened, um it was, and this was, I mean, like we weren't even wearing a mask yet. It was that fresh, right? So I met my new airline on reserve, fresh, you know, just graduated in December. This trip was in like January or February, and I had just worked a flight from New York to like I it was either Santo Domingo or Santiago, and I enjoyed it. So, and it was a red-eye flight, and I was like, oh, this was great. I don't know what everybody's talking about. On my day off, I'm going to pick up this exact same trip. So that's what I did, completely different. Everything was fine until so this gentleman he came on, he came on in a wheelchair, and right off the bat, when he was putting his things up, I went into the flight deck. I said, I think this man is drunk. I can't prove it because you can't just walk up to somebody and do. I was like, I can't prove it, but I think he is because he just tried to put his dog in the overhead bin. Oh no. You remember the United situation with the dog in the overhead? I was like, I he just tried to put his dog in the overhead bin and we had to tell him no. Um, and they just laughed, laughed it off. The pilots just laughed it off. They were like, oh, whatever. So during the flight, the the people around him got my attention. And, you know, I went over and they, you know, tell me in Spanish, you know, creo que es bracho, which means I think he's drunk. And I was like, I think so too. What makes you say that? And um, I don't remember what they told me. I think they said they smelled alcohol. So I walked over to him. I could smell alcohol, but I couldn't find it. And I knew I had not served him any drinks. And so I'm, you know, just talking to him. And um, when he opened his diet coke bottle, that's when I smelled this rum. And um he emptied it and I was like, oh, let me, I'll take that trash for you. I took it up front for proof. He rang his call bell and I went back over to him and he was talking, he motioned to me, like um, you know, to get closer. So I think he wanted to whisper something. I lean in and he grabs my head and pulls me towards him to try to kiss me.

Robb 21:23

Oh, no.

Jo 21:24

And I went off rapid Spanish, like, just get, you know, don't touch me, stop, you know, all this. And then he was like, What? What? You know, what what do you mean? What do you? I was like, all right, whatever. So I I go to the I to the front, I call the flight deck, I tell them what happened, and they're just like, okay, so what do you want us to? I'm like, sir, you you're trying, what do you mean? What do I want you to do? Pull this plane over so get it off. Yes, because I had come from like us. Remember, I said the last airline I was at, it was just one flight at Kidd. Pilots and they were very protective. So when I come to this bigger airline and it's not necessarily like that all the time, um, you really have to make your case. Sometimes you get a pilot that's like, yeah, I got your back immediately. And then sometimes you get the ones like this one. And um he was like, I mean, we're going to New York and we're just over Florida right now. I said, okay, so we can go to Fort Lauderdale, we can go to West Palm Beach, we can go to Miami, we go with like all these airports, we can go to even if you want to, you know, all these airports. We are like, we're, we need to stop because this man like just assaulted me. They were like, can you hold off until we get to New York? I just said fine and hung up. I was so over it. Um and we give them a break. Pilot comes out and he's asking me how everything's going. I was like, whatever, he's fine. He's asleep. He was not asleep. He came up while the captain was out, which is a big no-no. You're not supposed to approach when the pilots are out. And he uh was not listening when we're telling him to stop. He's still coming up and he gets all the way to the front, and the you know, captain's trying to talk to him, and he's the man is so drunk at this point, he no longer comprehends English.

Robb 23:09

Oh no.

Jo 23:09

Um, so I'm having to tell him in Spanish, and then he's drunk and like, this is my plane now. Um big red flag.

Robb 23:18

Oh no, you can't say that.

Jo 23:21

Right. So that was cute. Um, someone got him. So another passenger stood up and like pulled him away and everything. And so now the pilots are like, Oh, there's a problem. This is a problem. Get out of here, right? So um, they when we landed, they had called. I mean, we had TSA, Port Authority, NYPD, all these like law enforcement um officers, different kinds, just meeting the plane. And so they pull him off the plane and they just sit him in a wheelchair on the jet bridge with his dog. He urinates in the jet bridge. When, you know, the the agent is telling him, you know, I guess what their plan is with him, he realizes he's in trouble and he thinks I got him in trouble. And he tries to come back onto the plane, which is also this a no-no on a regular basis, but you know, with this situation, absolutely not. And it was a lot, it was, it was that was a long, long night.

Robb 24:26

Wow.

Jo 24:27

Yeah. So we had to stay behind and like fill out statement, like a police report and make a statement. Do you want to press charges? No, I just want to go home. Right. So that was the worst. Wow. The literal worst. Yeah. Um, so just between the first story and this story, you can just imagine the range of experiences I've had. Yeah.

Robb 24:47

And also that's that's, you know, for anyone listening, don't don't get on the plane drunk. Don't get drunk on the plane.

Jo 24:53

It's actually illegal.

Robb 24:54

You know, don't don't do that. And definitely don't announce that this is my plane now. That's hijacking. I don't know if you realize that, but that's literal hijacking. That's not a funny joke.

Jo 25:09

At all.

Robb 25:09

Yeah. Since since you know 2001, definitely uh

Jo 25:16

not what you want to say.

Robb 25:17

No, not at all. Not at all.

Jo 25:19

And sometimes on in that same vein, a lot of the jokes that people you know, it's like, hey, maybe don't when they joke about did you get enough rest? Actually, no, now I'm fatigued and I'm leaving and everybody has to get up, you know, or oh, it's the it's the pilot, or you nobody's drunk, are they? Thanks. Now we all have to go take a test.

Robb 25:41

Just because you said it out.

Jo 25:42

Just because you said it out loud, we have to go take a test. And now this whole flight is delayed, if not canceled. So just chill out. Come on, say hello, sit down, fasten your seatbelt, go to sleep, and leave me alone.

Robb 25:53

So so then from a flight attendance perspective, let's let's just say, what is the what what are like three three, five tips you can give to travelers to really make it the best experience for themselves and for the flight crew?

Jo 26:13

Um I think um so when you're booking, I want to say when you're booking your, if you have a connection or if you have an important event, you need to be strategic with how you're booking your flight. Um, because then your problem somehow becomes my problem. Um, you know, you I I'll say American Airlines will allow you to, they're the only airline I've seen where they allow you to book a connection that's like 20 minutes from touchdown to like the other flight taking off. And that's ridiculous because the door closes 15 minutes prior to departure.

Robb 26:53

Oh my gosh.

Jo 26:54

You know, and if you're going to Charlotte, if you're connecting in Charlotte, you can kiss that connection goodbye. Because I guarantee you're right, you're gonna land in E. We call it, we used to call it the dirty 30s. Okay, you're all the way down at the end of E, and then your connection is somewhere in A. Yeah, and you're it's gone. So how you book your connections, you really need to be pay attention to that. I say give yourself at least an hour. If you're traveling for an event, please do not travel the day of, come in the day before. That's tip number one. I would say for number two, just be pleasant. Um, you really do catch more flies with honey rather than vinegar. It does work. Um, just be nice to people when you're talking to them. Um, hello, how are you? I'm so sorry you're dealing with the thank you for for being here. Thank you for all you do. It seems like a lot, but it's really not. It, you know, um, be kind. Um when you come in, look at your seat, sit in your assigned seat, please. Um, if there are other seats available within your section, you can move, but don't just go sit in somebody else's seat.

Robb 28:08

Once the door is shut, don't like try and like move. Plan musical chairs while before while people are still bored and even even if like the seat looks free on the app, right?

Jo 28:18

Like, oh, I know nobody's sitting over there. But some of us travel by plane to get to work, flight attendants, pilots, family, you know, family members going on vacation, we're non-reading, we're flying standby. So that seat that you think is free is actually my seat. So you need to, you know, get up. Um if you know that you're a nervous flyer, please take a Benadryl. Take a Benadryl or something and not a drink. Not a drink. Don't take a drink. Now look, some people, when you're up in the air, right, order, order one drink and go to sleep. If that works for you. But if you're a sloppy drunk or you know, you know how you are on the ground, because a lot of people don't know this, that that the um elevation actually impacts how you, you know.

Robb 29:15

Yeah, your body processes alcohol.

Jo 29:17

Exactly. So where when I'm not a big drinker anymore, like I was when I first started. But at the time, you know, like say I know that I can have three drinks on the ground and be okay, you know, just tipsy in the air, it's not gonna be three drinks, it's gonna be one. You know, so everyone's a little different, but just you know, keep that in mind as well. If you're traveling with kids, bring entertainment for them.

Robb 29:44

I love that. Those are great tips. Those are great tips. Um I know, like you know, and is and is sometimes it's the little things, like you said, when you're being being polite to the flight crew, they're there, you're you're at work. You're you're doing your job. And you're in your job is hospitality basically to the passengers, but also there's a lot of stuff that's safety related that you're trying to make sure happens.

Jo 30:08

The safety is the priority, and the hospitality is supplementary and they are interwoven together. And sometimes you'll get somebody who's firm. They're just doing their job. I'm firm but nice, right? Like I always tell people you know how you sound when you talk to people. You know what you can say. There are things that you could say to somebody, Rob, that I could never say. But then there's things I could say that maybe you could not say, right? You just gotta know that about yourself.

Robb 30:36

Yeah. Um Do you appreciate it like if uh if um uh a I don't know what they call them, whoever's flying. What do you call them? Do you call them guests? Do you call them flyers? I don't know.

Jo 30:49

Oh well, like at my air, I would just call them customers. Customers, okay. They usually the the general term would be like passengers.

Robb 30:55

Passengers I'm so dumb. I'm so old. I can't I can't even remember the word passenger. Stupid nouns. Uh as I get older, I can't remember nouns. Passengers. Um like if they give you like, hey, here's a little treat for you. Like here's a little pack of Twizzlers or something, or yeah.

Jo 31:12

Yeah. Um, if I get a treat, then you will also be getting a treat. That should mean not everybody is like that. I will, but it it just lifts your spirits. And I, you know, I love that. And so I'll just be like, what do you need? Most flight crews are going to be that way. Give them whatever they ask for. Hey, this this person in 13B just gave the whole crew all of this. Oh, there's an empty seat over here that's not a middle seat. Let me move them. Um, let me, oh, what do you want? You want a cheese tray? You know, unofficially. May we're not saying that that is, you know, but we we try to take care of people who kind of go will go.

Robb 31:56

Yeah. They try to take care of you. Yeah. I mean, because yeah, like I said, you are working. We don't know how many flights back and forth. You know, if I'm on a hopper or something, or I'm just, you know what I mean? You might be making that trip three, four times in a day. I don't know what the, you know, it depends on the length and how long you're on the flight and all that stuff. Because I have been on a flight. It was and when I say it was one of the worst flights, it has nothing to do with the crew. It was uh we were flying to Maui and we went from I think Augusta to Dallas. I'm just gonna say I hate DFW. It's garbage. Um and we the when we got there, the plane wasn't ready, which okay, that happens. It's like, oh, it'll be you know an hour in between. Okay, great. Again, we had to walk across from one end to the other when we got to the other end. They're like, oh, by the way, this plane's now out of commission. You got to go back to the other side. That's where you knew plane. And we ended up doing like two or three different times. And they're like, oh, well, we got a plane for you, but uh we have to change the oil on it. I'm like, okay, that needs to h that's important. And it got to the point where they're like, if we do not take off in the next slide, if we don't it's like if we don't take off in the next 10 minutes, the crew is going to time out. And you're just on the plane and we took off. And it's an eight-hour flight to Maui from DFW. So we waited eight hours. We were in DFW for eight hours, and then we're about to take another eight-hour flight. Horrible. The flight, but like I said, the flight was because by the time we got on the plane, I was like, I'm just gonna pass out. I'm just gonna go I'm going to sleep. Wake up. I will wake up in a you know, a different state. But yeah. Um but yeah, it's those things like that that you don't think of as a passenger. That's like, oh, I don't know how many trips you know his crew has been on so far, or what they've had to deal with in their previous ones. So everyone's a reset. Treat people the way you want you would like to be treated. Exactly. Kindness goes a long way, I think. Yeah, yeah. Do you have a favorite treat that you like to see somebody?

Jo 34:06

Um I'm an oddball. I know everybody loves their Starbucks or Duncan gift cards, which is fine. Um, I'll take them, whatever. I do enjoy like when they bring little sweet treats like chocolate or whatever, but I also my favorite is the hand sanitizer. I love when someone gives me hand sanitizer. I mean, it's never just hand sanitizer. It's always a little baggie with like stuff in it. It's got hand sanitizer and like mints and stuff. But I love when I get the hand sanitizer I had. Like literally, I was working a flight, I think it was JFK to LA or something. And I always, you know, because I'm touching people's bags, we're still in the pandemic, and I'm touching everybody's bags and stuff. And so um every few, you know, touches, I'm sanitizing.

Robb 35:02

Yeah, yeah.

Jo 35:03

And um uh I I was at the jump seat and I was went to squeeze out some sanitizer and nothing came out. And I looked, I was like, oh no, I'm out. And I didn't have, I could not find my spare. I was having a little panic attack. I thought nobody could see me, but the people in the exit row right in the jump seat area saw me. And um, this guy, he's a firefighter, and he was like, I got you. And he like reached his back, he was like, Which one do you want? He had 20 different Oh, that's awesome. Like, that's my favorite. I love the hand sanitizer. I'm a dork, I know, but that's awesome.

Robb 35:39

What's uh been one of your favorite uh trips that you've been on that you've that you've had to work? Because is it sounds like you've worked international as well as uh you know domestic? Um is there a favorite domestic and a favorite international you've done?

Jo 35:54

Um my favorite domestic.

Robb 35:58

Oh, these are just interesting things to me because like I don't get to talk to folks like this before.

Jo 36:04

Like my favorite domestics to work or the actual layover? To to to work. To work.

Robb 36:11

To work, yeah.

Jo 36:12

Um okay, I'm I'm gonna say this is I'm gonna say Fort Myers, Florida. Those people are so nice. They are so nice. I I'm always like, wow, what's in the water in Fort Myers? They're so nice. So I think um, yeah, JFK to Fort Myers or Fort Myers, JFK, that's like to work it is great. Um internationally to work, I love Guayaquil, Ecuador. I love the layover and I love the people um on the fights. Again, just so nice. It's a nice crowd of people. I'm just gonna enjoy myself. And um, even if it's it's a lot of work, you know, you're you're gonna be working, working, um, which that's what I'm there for. Everybody's like, I'm sorry to disturb you. You're literally not. I'm here to get you your water, um, you know, whatnot. And then um the layover is just I just love it. It's hot. It's literally Ecuador means equator. Right, right. It's like right on the equator, it's very hot. Um, but it's affordable. Everyone is so helpful. Um, and I love taking Denise there. Um, you know, that was now when I go back, it's just not the same because she's not with me. But um, yeah.

Robb 37:34

I love that. I love that. Um Jo, what's bringing you joy right now?

Jo 37:43

What's bringing me joy right now? Well, obviously my my brothers get married this week is a very joyful time for us. But in general, I have to say enjoying my rent, enjoying being home with my wife and my two cats just brings me so much joy to just sit there on our patio on the roof and or grill something and be at the house with a drink and a good book.

Robb 38:14

Yeah.

Jo 38:15

It's just little, literally just little things in life that just brings me the greatest joy right now, which can just be encapsulated by enjoying the rent that I home.

Robb 38:28

Yeah. No, that's and that's important. I mean, I think, you know, there are a lot of times, you know, especially when we're younger, we think we have to be going and doing it, this and that, and blah, blah, blah. And you like you said, you're spending money on this rent, you're never there. It's like, well, no, this is an investment. This is this is part of it. I you know, I've gone on vacations where you spend the extra and get like a nice Airbnb. And it's like, hey, this is part of the vacation too. We're gonna stay here. We're not always gonna go out somewhere.

Jo 38:57

This is we love an excursion. Excursions are cute, right? But uh resting is cuter.

Robb 39:04

Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Jo 39:08

Yeah, after like going, and I mean, even when we first, you know, were together, we were doing a lot more traveling together. Um, but now, especially like with the way my work schedule has been manipulated to where I just work on the weekends, Saturday, Sunday, and Monday. And during the week, I don't want to go anywhere.

Robb 39:26

Right.

Jo 39:26

Had a rough sem it wasn't rough because it was hard, but the semester being what it was and just want to be home, just want to enjoy my my time at home.

Robb 39:38

Yeah, yeah, I love that. Um, and for and and because I forgot to mention about your pursuit uh for your pilot's license. Where did that when did you decide that to go from flight attendant to to pilot?

Jo 39:55

I was at my my last airline, which was a smaller regional. I was based in Philadelphia, which is how I wound up in Philly. Um, and you know, you go up to give the pilot stir break. And so you're seeing things. Um it's just beautiful, just everything. You just like you just start the curiosity got the best of me. I start asking questions. What does this do? What does this button do? So how do you, you know, like, well, how do you read this and like just asking questions? And they'd be like, you're really smart. Like, not that I'm saying flight attendants are stupid, but you're, you know, and I'm you should do this. You do more work in the back than I do up here. And I'm like, you're lying. And they're like, no, seriously. So I I started just asking a lot of questions and asking, how did you do it? What was your journey? Is it easier to go through a zero-to-hero program through like a PP flight school, for instance, where they fast track it, or is it better to go through a smaller flight school where you just kind of, you know, lesson by lesson as you can afford it, or did you go through a university? Um, just asking those questions. And I took a discovery flight. Um, and just, you know, for the heck of it, and I was like, oh my God, I love this. Whoa, I I love this. I love being in charge. Um, and and so I came back and I was like, yeah, this is what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna move to the other side of the door officially. So I got a lot of mentors um at that last airline and and still, you know, friends with a lot of them to this day. And that's how it started. Now we're just trying to get the money. Yeah.

Robb 41:32

Yeah. Yeah. Is there a is there a date you're hoping to kind of go through and to get to be done by?

Jo 41:39

Yeah. So hopefully I'll be I'll have graduated from my university in 2028. Awesome. Um, which would, of course, means I have all of my flight ratings and stuff. Um, and I'll have my aviation management degree. So, you know, you never know what happens. Yeah. You want to have a backup plan so I could still be in the industry. Um, and I would move from my major airline back to a smaller regional because that's the path you have to take. You have to go through a regional. After you build time, you go to a regional and then you go back up to a major if you want. Um, so hopefully 2028, you'll see me back at a regional airline as a first officer.

Robb 42:23

I love it.

Jo 42:23

That would be great.

Robb 42:24

It'll happen. It'll happen. I 100% believe that that will happen.

Jo 42:28

Your lips from your lips to God's ears.

Robb 42:36

All right, Jo, this is the second segment of the show. This is where we dive a little bit deeper into your mental health journey. I definitely believe that the more we talk about it, the easier it is for us, but also easier for those that hear it to realize they're not alone. So for you, how do you keep the darkness at bay?

Jo 42:54

I keep the darkness at bay through therapy is very important. Um, and I have a I have a really strong village, I think. Um my wife is my rock. Um I can still call my parents for anything. Um, my younger brother and I have great friends. Um and just trying to hold myself accountable, you know, for like I I feel like yeah, you should have a strong village, but that doesn't mean that you make it like I don't want to bombard everybody with with my mental health all the time. I feel like you have to do the work at the same time. Um yeah, so that's right.

Robb 43:49

Yeah, I was just gonna say so it's it's because you're not trying to burden them with what you've got because you have you have to carry that burden, you have to help line it. But knowing that there's a support to support you. In that.

Jo 44:01

Right. You know. You don't want to it's with you think of support, if you think of support, your support system as a structural being, right? Like a ballast or um support beams or something. If you put too much weight, um, then it's gonna break. Um, an airplane, if you put too much weight in the you know, forward or the aft, you could wind up in a horrible, dangerous situation um where you stall out and you're and you're gone, right? The plane's gone. Um, so if you think of your support system in those ways, then it helps you balance how you're leaning on them for support versus how you're utilizing therapy and whatever tools and resources that therapy provides to you to do on your own.

Robb 44:52

Yeah.

Jo 44:53

Yeah.

Robb 44:53

Yeah. Um was there a a time because you talk about when you were in college and you hit the depression?

Jo 45:03

Right.

Robb 45:04

Was there something that triggered that?

Jo 45:07

Um now that I'm older, I can absolutely say that it was probably just a pressure to succeed because of the environment that I came from, being the eldest daughter. And then my mom and I talked it to my mom, her degrees and parts like therapy and stuff. So she recognized retroactively maybe the environment that I was in that maybe contributed to my mental health. And it wasn't anything bad necessarily. It's just, you know, went to a competitive school. I am the oldest and I'm a girl, you know, and um, you know, and um, and so I I want, I guess I struggled with perfectionism, but I didn't realize that that's what it was because I feel like I'm such a, you know, a go with the flow kind of person. My mom calls me her butterfly, you know, that kind of stuff. So just um, so I've I thought, oh, it can't be that because I'm just, you know, one of those free people. But even within that, you're still like, but I still have to do this and I have to, even though I passed, I want to pass with an A. I want to, you know, like it's those kinds of pressures that you put on yourself. And then if you are seeing that you're not doing as well, I like I'm a competitive person. I try not to be, but you see other people around you doing better, right, at certain things, and and you start feeling like a failure, even though you didn't fail.

Robb 46:39

Yeah.

Jo 46:40

And then so you start becoming that thing that you think you are. So you start failing. And that's what happened to me. I started like, well, I might as well not even do it. And then it's like, hey girl, you're in the middle of a class. You're you have to do that paper. You but I wasn't. It's just like, yeah.

Robb 47:02

So if I can't be first, why even run the race at all?

Jo 47:05

Yeah. I'm horrible, but that's exactly the kind of person that I I was gonna say that I was, but it's just who I am, and I had to come to terms with that and work through that.

Robb 47:20

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, because that's something that even with even with therapy, even with your support system, you know, end of the day, that is internal to you, and it's you have to find a way to manage that.

Jo 47:34

Yeah.

Robb 47:34

To overcome that. Um and so what was that that and being able and and you just being able to recognize it, you yeah, that's still a part of me. There's still a part of me that if if it's if it's either a coming third or not come in first, I'm gonna Yeah, what was it?

Jo 47:53

Uh Talladega nights.

Robb 47:55

Yeah.

Jo 47:55

If you're not first, you're last.

Robb 47:57

Yeah, yeah.

Jo 47:58

That was that's yeah, that's me sometimes. Like I definitely I I know that there's this I I love it for the kids that they are able to be like, C's get degrees, right? And I'm just not that person.

Robb 48:14

And I know that about myself, even you know, so what has that journey been like for you to kind of come combat that, to accept it as part of you, but also to work around that, to realize that yes, you know, if if I'm not first, I'm still just as much viable in whatever field or whatever I'm doing without being the you know the gold star winner.

Jo 48:44

Yeah, I really had to stop internalizing those feelings, and that's where I started to lean on the support, right? Because instead of I'm used to being the support, and I had to be like, okay, you've got your wife. Cause she she would be, are you okay? Is she cool, right? Like she go, you know, so um had to start talking to her about stuff in this room. She was like, You need to go back to therapy, you need to go to therapy. Um, and then talking to my mom, and I love that she put a therapist hat on when talking to me. I was going to her as, you know, a daughter. And she, you know, of course, talking to me as mom, but then I could hear like the work that she had been doing in her classes and stuff, like coming out to help me. And she was saying, you know, you probably going through like imposter syndrome and you know, that um eldest daughter thing. And you we talk about it, but that is really like a clinical thing that people go through. Um, and if it's not addressed, it can lead to, you know, some serious depression. And um, yeah, so just like really talking to people and realizing girls, you got a problem. Um, and and that's what led me to seeking more professional help to yeah, just to to sort things out, I guess.

Robb 50:14

Yeah. And do you feel like now where you are today? I mean, you know, every day is a step step forward. Sometimes we step back a little bit, but you feel where you are today. Um I don't want to say over the hump, but you're at a place where it's easier to keep taking those steps forward as opposed to taking that step back, those come fewer and fewer.

Jo 50:36

Yeah, I think too, um, I don't view them as like steps back. I view it as like, let me, I'm being proactive to when I see Denise and I were just talking about this. Um, you know, like, oh, maybe I should go back to therapy because I can start seeing some little patterns that I maybe had in the past. I can see them trying to bubble up to the surface a little bit. So maybe I should let's tackle this in therapy, you know, real quick before it becomes a bigger problem, before I'm failing a semester. Um, taking a break when I know I need it. Um, you know, if that means not going to work, um, you know, for a couple of weeks and then maybe making up by working a little bit more the next month. Um, you know, that is something that I, you know, that I do. But that's I do see that I am in a better place than I was, um, especially because I think I have the the wherewithal to notice or to recognize, okay, this is about to be a thing. And let's talk about it and like work on it before it like ru like before it really sets me back, you know, in different endeavors in my life.

Robb 51:56

So yeah. Yeah, no, and that's that's important. And and you said there knowing when to rest is very important because as someone who's a high functioning type of person, like rest is for the weak. You know what I mean? I can I can go and go and go. It's like, no, you can't. It's okay. Rest can still mean progress.

Jo 52:22

You know, rest can still and rest is absolute progress. Rest is revolutionary, rest is it's just all these things that um I really had to recognize that I um in order to participate in it. Um, especially you you mentioned like the high functioning. That was something my mom was worried about with me. Um, that I was a high functioning uh depressive person or depressed person. Um, because the high functioning ones are the ones you you need to worry about anybody who's depressed, right? But the high functioning ones, I think, are the ones where it's like, where did that come from? Right. Like when they when they die by suicide, right? What what happened? They were so happy. Yeah, what you know? They were so strong. They were so funny, they were so exactly. And so I think that's what worried different people within my sphere, making sure that I was not gonna be in that statistic. Um, and so rest uh definitely became an important part of my um treatment. Um, and and just recognizing it's something necessary that everybody deserves rest.

Robb 53:49

All right, Jo, this is the third segment of the show. It's time now for the fast five, the fast five. It's time now for the fast five. Fast Five. Sorry, still working on that theme song. Uh fast five is powered by Poddex. It's an app created by my friend Travis Brown. If you go to chewingthefatbr.com slash poddex, it'll take you to where you can download that to your favorite uh, you know, app store. Um it's made for podcasters, but they're really great icebreaker questions. No wrong answers, just the first thing comes to the top of your mind. You ready?

Jo 54:23

Okay.

Robb 54:23

No worries. Don't, don't, don't be nervous. It's all good. All right, here we go. Question number one. What's the last thing you've done that you were really proud of?

Jo 54:35

I got a 4.0 last semester. Oh, yeah.

Robb 54:41

That's awesome.

Jo 54:42

Yeah.

Robb 54:42

Congratulations. That's that's definitely something to be proud of. That's great. Question number two. What do you love to do for others?

Jo 54:54

Give, cook.

Robb 54:56

Cook.

Jo 54:56

Host, all of that, yes. Oh, okay. Yeah.

Robb 54:58

Be the be the hostess.

Jo 55:02

Okay. I love that.

Robb 55:03

I love that. And that that kind of goes into your nature of hospitality and care. And yeah, I love that. I love that. Question number three. What do you want your legacy to be?

Jo 55:19

Oh God. Um I don't know. Um kindness?

Robb 55:26

No, no, that's that's a perfectly great legacy. A legacy of kindness. Yeah. You know, in a in a world that sometimes shuns kindness.

Jo 55:36

Especially now.

Robb 55:37

You know? Yeah. I think having a legacy of kindness that you were always kind, that you always, if if someone had you know something going on they could come to you and not feel ostracized.

Jo 55:48

Maybe it's maybe judged a little bit, but not just. And they're definitely gonna get that. Yeah. You know that about me.

Robb 55:57

Yeah. But also done in a way that's not demeaning to someone like that. Exactly. Legacy of kindness. I love that. Uh, legacy of kindness is amazing. Question number four. What's the weirdest place you've gone to the bathroom?

Jo 56:14

Uh what?

Robb 56:16

Yeah.

Jo 56:17

Um I don't know. Um, an airplane.

Robb 56:22

I mean, I thought that might be that was, you know, a few miles above the air. 36,000 feet in the air. Over over the Atlantic Ocean. You know. That's great. And question number five. What's the best relationship advice someone has ever given you?

Jo 56:49

Be friends. Yes, be friends, because at the end of the day, you can love somebody, but do you like them? Do you want to spend time with them? Especially as you get older and certain things ebb and flow, right? Like your libido. You're not always gonna want to put them through the mattress, but do you want to sit on the couch and talk to them and spend time with them? Um, yeah, that is some of the best advice I've gotten.

Robb 57:20

Yeah.

Jo 57:21

And it works.

Robb 57:21

It's like, do you want to enjoy the rent with this person?

Jo 57:24

Yes, and I do.

Robb 57:25

Yeah. As opposed to like, because you know, when you go out, sometimes going out is a distraction because there's all these other things going on that you don't have to sit, read the book, pet the cat, and just be.

Jo 57:39

Yeah.

Robb 57:40

I love that. I love that. Well, that is our fast five, and that's the show. Jo, thank you so much for being here.

Jo 57:47

Thanks for having me.

Robb 57:48

Thank you for making time for this. Uh I really, really do appreciate it. If folks want to keep up with you and uh your journey to pilot or anything like that, what's the best way they could do that?

Jo 57:58

Um, I guess on threads.

Robb 58:02

Ooh.

Jo 58:03

Yeah, because my Instagram's private. But I mean, if you find me on threads, obviously you would find me on Instagram, but it's air underscore jolo. Um, and that is how you can keep up with me.

Robb 58:15

Awesome, awesome. I'll make sure I put those links on the show notes. Again, thank you so much for being here, making time while y'all are in town for wedding to stop by and talk to me.

Jo 58:24

Of course, we love you. As Denise said, you are VIP.

Robb 58:28

And that means the world to me. And I love you and everything you got going on, and I know without a doubt you are going to succeed in your dreams.

Jo 58:38

Robb, I love you. I'm gonna hold your hand.

Robb 58:42

And if you would like to support this podcast, I'd appreciate it if you bought me a coffee at chewingthefatbr.com. But until next time, I look forward to the chance we have to sit a spell and chew the fat.